Montana vs Frenzy

[Travis Cook]

I'm trying to fill out my kite quiver and need a foil in the 9M range. I'm considering either the Montana HQ or the Frenzy. Opinions? Pros and cons? Bordy? I'm sure you don't feel very strongly about this...

[Kenny]

Travis,

If possible fly both before making a choice. However, if you want to make the choice right away, I will give you my personal opinion. I have owned many Ozone kites. I currently have 5 of them (2010 3.5 Imp, 2010, 6M Access, 7.1M 2003 Frenzy, 9.3M 2003 Frenzy, 2007 12M Frenzy). Yes, I know some of my Frenzy kites are old, but I have had the opportunity to fly every new Frenzy and I have owned larger Frenzy kites from 2004 - 2008. I have also had the opportunity to fly the Montana HQ in several sizes and several different model years. I think Ozone has always been a step or two ahead of Montana. The 2009 model Frenzy and Manta both had dramatically improved wind ranges. The Frenzy is a refined kite. Personally, I like it better than the Manta. The Frenzy has been optimized to fly in light wind and is super stable. The designer Rob Whitall is a dedicated snowkiter and he has optimized the kite specifically for that purpose. Thats my two cents. I recommend trying before buying because no one kite is perfect for everyone or every riding situation. You have to find the kite that suits your riding style and taste.

Kenny

[JimSouthwick]

Kenny,

On a somewhat related note, how do Flysurfer kites compare with Frenzies as snow kites?

Jim

[mike loeser]

I'll chime in to defend the Montana since I am probably the only one here that rides them. I started using them due to cost, which previously was a much bigger difference than it is now. The first two years the kites were a few years behind the Ozone. They have stepped it up since then and are putting out great kites. I know Brian Schenck will slam me for this, but for the average rider cost is still a consideration and here in Utah where some are riding foils and inflatables, the costs can add up quick. Buying full quivers for winter and summer can cost you over $5,000 with all the other things needed. A spendy sport! So for the guy that is just going to be cruising around, getting a few airs and such - no triple handle pass 1080s - That rider may have fun flying a Peter Lynn querilla. I doubt most can actually tell a huge difference between a good kite and even a bad one. I know most of my kite problems are rider error and have nothing to do with the kite itself. I could just suck though.
Anyhow, the Montana 3s, 4s and 5s are great kites and you will end up paying quite a bit less especially going second hand. If you need a 9.5m I would sell you my Montana 3 9.5 for $400, I doubt you'll find a 2006 Frenzy for that price. Just looked and saw a 2005 10m Frenzy for $400 on Ebay. The Montana 3 is from the 2007/08 season. You are welcome to try it out and let me know what you think. I'd like to upgrade to the Montana 5. They have improved the bars on the 4s and 5s. I have ridden Ozone and HQ and can't really say one was hugely better than the other. I've heard both sides from people, but I don't think many here in Utah have actually flown anything but Ozone kites. Shows how Brian is doing his job and that Ozone does make great kites. Thanks Brian, now don't flame me or cut my lines!
Later,
Mike L.

[bordy]

try before you buy, sounds like you can fly a bunch of kites then decide, You already have a frenzy and know whats up? Try a HQ in the same size and then make up your mind!

[Kenny]

Local representation is important and should never be estimated. We fly a lot of Ozone and Best kites because it is easy to demo those kites. If you have a problem you have a trusted person that you can speak with about the issue. Brian & Heather Schenck, Ozone Kites and Jacob Buzianis, Best have built a following because they are also people of integrity. They want to grow the sport and they are extremely helpful.

Mike, I have to take issue with one blanket statement that you made, "I doubt most can actually tell a huge difference between a good kite and a bad one." I disagree. Unfortunately, the decision to buy a particular kite is often based on the wrong criteria (price, promised features, what the pros ride, how cool it looks in the magazine, etc.). I can see a new rider thinking, "if there is not much difference in kites, I will pick up that 2002 kite for $50 of of ebay." I have seen that mistake happen far too many times. I thank Billy for teaching so many people and helping them get set up with the right gear. Look at how fast some of his students have progressed. Part of the reason is technique, part is proper gear selection.

Jim, Flysurfer has a line of 5 kites, so comparing them to the Frenzy - well that is tough to do. The kite that compares the most closely is the Outlaw (also an open-cell foil dedicated for snow and land use). However, an Outlaw is more like an Ozone Manta (higher aspect ratio kite). I fly the big Speed 3 19M. It is an pricey, light wind machine that is worthwhile if you use it on the snow and water. It is big, but manageable due the huge amount of depower. I really like light wind riding and the big speed has given me a lot more days on the water and the snow.

[mike loeser]

Sorry, I should've mentioned that I was talking about newer kites. Safety is also first priority. I wouldn't touch a lot of the those older kites myself let alone for someones first kite. I was trying to say that about the Montanas 1 and 2 and definitely don't anyone go out and buy a Peter Lynn guerilla. I just don't think there are any major brand kites built today that are vastly superior for the average rider. I know a lot of people here get over a hundred days riding in a year (of which I am sooo jealous), for them it probably does matter. To get away from the Hq kites so I don't feel so picked on, just compare two typical Utah kites. An 11m Waroo complete is about $1,000 and the 11m Ozone Edge lists at $1,900. The smiles are just as big whichever kite you pick. Just some people still can pay the rent. Costs aside, my point actually being that some will notice the difference in these kites, but I think both riders would enjoy themselves with either kite. Most here would honestly say the Ozone is the better kite, no offense to Best. The fun factor is still the same with either kite and isn't that why we kite? I would rather see someone out kiting on crappy gear (although safe) than sitting at home.
Kenny,
Where did you get to test the Montanas, and what years? I know Cloud Nine has sold some in the past and would help anyone that bought from there. So you do get local dealer support with the Montana. Also enjoyed some nice orange rolls this morning to keep me riding bigger kites then I really want. Thanks for that and the forecasts. Unfortunately that is why I caught this topic and opened my big fat mouth.
Hope the forecast changes for tomorrow.
Mike L.

[Mark Johnson]

I would ride a Peter Lynn guerilla. If I had to.

[Kenny]

Where did you get to test the Montanas, and what years? I know Cloud Nine has sold some in the past and would help anyone that bought from there. So you do get local dealer support with the Montana. Also enjoyed some nice orange rolls this morning to keep me riding bigger kites then I really want. Thanks for that and the forecasts. Unfortunately that is why I caught this topic and opened my big fat mouth.
Hope the forecast changes for tomorrow.

Mike, Glad to hear that you enjoyed the Rhodes Orange Rolls! As I recall HQ was at the Snowkite Masters at Skyline last year. I also had the chance when a visitor to Skyline let me take his kite for a spin. Not sure about the model year.

I agree that not everyone has the bucks to buy the latest and greatest. I just wish some people would do a little research first. For example I saw some kiters at Skyline yesterday with newer C kites. Fortunately, the wind was steady. Unfortunately, they were having a difficult timing relaunching the kite. The interesting part is that the group consisted of 2 guys and 2 girls. The guys were riding HQ foils and the girls both had the C kites. I don't know who did the kite distribution, but the girls were having a lot less fun than the guys. One girl had to walk her kite back to the launch after struggling to relaunch it for about 2 hours.