Snowboard speed...62.3mph

[Jason Klein]

I think we can all agree that we don't want to see Billy's Gord get blown......

[RickHeninger]

I don't care... Those are some insanely fast speeds... Unreal! The cool thing is that a kite is a pretty good brake too...

All I know is that in 1978 at 9 years of age I looked off the stern of my Bic Dufor Wing and saw a wake... I could have sworn I was doing 60+MPH!

As far as kite speed vs. windsurf speed... Apples and oranges... But a kite board has much less friction on the water than a sailboard.... So, it's pretty logical to me that a kite on the water is faster than a sailboard.

[bordy]

Billy, the battle between kiting and sailing top speed will never end.


The fixed wing idea is not a bad one though. The problem is when you crash, the wing is instantly toasted. :

Leo this is not a issue kiting vs windsurfing, there is no battle, Kiting is sailing it's a shame more people can't see it as such. Your self included, many of your comments seperate the two on purpose I don't take offense to it but you just are sticking to "your favorite" not looking at the facts, as a lover of all the sailing choices I think it is silly. You are riding the wind, having a mast vs strings, a boom vs a bar, and a kite vs a sail is silly they all proform the same task.

But the physics of higher sail placement via a kite up high above surface turbulance, and the ability to move the sail around in the wind give one a true advantage I am not pitching kiting becuase I am currently a kiter, I am talking about these obvious advantages to make the most power from the wind to haul arse, just as a composite wing is more powerful then a rigged sail or a slick low cockpit vessal makes less drag then a human standing on a platform.

Of course you are going to blow up your wing when you crash it, what do you think happens to greenbird, of hydroptere if it goes over, you don't just right it like a sunfish and keep on truckin! high tech gear is almost always fragile.

[Leo Chan]

Billy, if we don't talk trash about kiting and sailing, that's not fun.

I know both are essentially using the same force from Mother Nature. I do see the difference. I mentioned this a few times in the past. I sail because of the ability to go far, far from the launching area. I see the advancement of sailing technology an important aspect in this sport. I think it is important that sailing technology develops further to deal with the drag force issue in the race course. I am sure the technology can be transferred to regular sailing. My sail boat will have a mast and a sail.

[JimSouthwick]

Much as we poleboarders hate to admit it, it’s pretty obvious that most kiterboarders are faster than most poleboarders most of the time. But why? Rick notes that the average kiteboard has much less wetted surface than the average sailboard, which means less drag (all other things being equal) and that is probably a factor. Billy points out that high above the surface where kites operate, the wind is stronger and less turbulent. That, coupled with the rider’s ability to “sine” his kite means that kites can generate an enormous amount of power even when the surface wind is relatively light - but then, so can big sails. The kiter’s real advantage is that he can handle considerably more power. Why? The explanation appears in the text of a patent (United State Patent #5,366,182) granted in 1994 to William G. Roeseler and his son, Gorge kiting pioneer Cory Roeseler: “The tractive force of the airfoil [the kite] is applied at the center of lateral resistance of the conveyance device [the board or, in Cory’s early career, water skis] such that there is no destabilizing moment caused by the airfoil, thereby removing an artificial limit on the sail area that is imposed upon fixed mast sailing craft [and to a lesser extent on windsurfers].” Jim Drake, inventor of the windsurfer, acknowledged this advantage in the course of a discussion of speed sailing ( http://2008.star-board.com/2008/pages/c ... igners.php ): “Here again, the conventional approach - in this case, high wind, small (special) sail, small board and special fin -- has run into the side of "The Box", at about 50 knots. Even if not, it will shortly when the fin can no longer be kept from cavitating. But don't bet on "The Box" holding. The fin's function can be transferred to a surface piercing cavitating inclined plane and the sail's drive can be increased by lowering its center-of-effort to the harness hook - borrowing from its cousins, the kite-board and the kite.” Elsewhere, Drake has suggested that in the future, sailors attempting to raise the windsurfer speed record may need to ride the windward rail just as kiteboarders have always done.

[Craig Goudie]

While I agree with the physics, that just hasn't been my experience on the water ;*)

-Craig

Much as we poleboarders hate to admit it, it’s pretty obvious that most kiterboarders are faster than most poleboarders most of the time.

[bordy]

While I agree with the physics, that just hasn't been my experience on the water ;*)

-Craig

Much as we poleboarders hate to admit it, it’s pretty obvious that most kiterboarders are faster than most poleboarders most of the time.

Maybe we should have a mass start at the summer games and see how our local crews messure up! Boats boards n kites.

[Leo Chan]

While I agree with the physics, that just hasn't been my experience on the water ;*)

-Craig

Much as we poleboarders hate to admit it, it’s pretty obvious that most kiterboarders are faster than most poleboarders most of the time.

Our local crews are a lot better than the average kiters out there. In east coast, I always beat kiters on speed, even when I stay near the launching area. About a mile out, they just eat my water sprays.

[Craig Goudie]

That would be cool! I will say that the Gorge Blow Out is always won by a a Kite Skier, and not by a
small margin either. It's all good.

-Craig

While I agree with the physics, that just hasn't been my experience on the water ;*)

-Craig

Much as we poleboarders hate to admit it, it’s pretty obvious that most kiterboarders are faster than most poleboarders most of the time.

Maybe we should have a mass start at the summer games and see how our local crews messure up! Boats boards n kites.

[jason morton]

Windsurfers will be faster than kiters riding twin-tip boards. This has always been the case, for the most part. Now there is a new kid on the block. The "race board". These boards are considerably faster than twin-tips with a much bigger range. And the funny thing is these boards are kiteboard formula boards. They are designed to point high into the wind and deep off of the wind. The broad reaches are more survival than speed. Noone has really made a slalom board(beam and broad reaching design) for kiting. This board will look similar to a kite race board with a more surfy outline, tucked rails that get harder as you go back to the tail, but with a flatter rockerline than a surf board. It will also have a tri or quad fins that are still pointer fins but more swept back. It will also have a concave similar to a windsurf high wind slalom board(single to double concave with chimed rails). Surfboards for kiting are not very fast. These boards will surely be WAY fast!!! Can't wait to get one

[Josh Shirley]

I like the Ronston bridge race in San Francisco. Crissy fields to Berkley marina and back. Sail boats, windsurfers, and kite boarders. Each year a different "class" wins the race. A lot of it has to do with the wind conditions as to which "class" has the advantage. Typically high winds the windsurfers win. Low winds the sailboats win. And medium winds the kiteboarders win. Also note that Jake's B brother has the fastest course time on a windsurfer.

I think over time the kites will get better in the high winds. Of course everyone has a long way to go to catch the mega tri cats. Those guys are rewritting the standards, and they are doing it on vessels that aren't only limited to speed trenches.

[Emmanuel Pons]

Sounds to me like we need a Utah Lake crossing race to settle this

[Shawn Henderson]

How big a purse would it take to get this turnout? Add lots of kites and we could take over that Utah Lake commision thing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRI_H2IWNvc&playnext_from=TL&videos=rCcausfCeRk

Sounds to me like we need a Utah Lake crossing race to settle this

[Josh Shirley]

How about a $50 gift certificate to the DI?

[Leo Chan]

We should move the discussion to a new thread. I like the idea. Though I would not want a $50 certificate to the DI. Let's talk more.