Lincoln Butter Etiquette Suggestions

[ChrisPSherwin]

Based on some previous conversations I thought I would throw this out there for discussion...

1) If you're out at "sea" and coming into the butter zone, stay upwind as close to the jetty as possible. This would allow people just downwind of you (in the butter) to jump. It also allows people in the butter to haul ass and hit the first wave on the point and go into orbit.

2) If you're hucking anywhere - remember that downwind people have the right of way. If you're going so big that you wander into their zip code, they probably can't hear you yelling from the air "look out." If they're wearing an ipod in both ears, they definitely can't hear you. One ear - maybe. I have aborted jumps on many occasions because I thought I might drift too far downwind into another's path.

3) Beginners that are not jumping. If you are in the butter area, try to avoid making sudden maneuvers in the landing zone. There are people going huge just upwind of you. You have the right of way, and so do I when I'm there. But if I see Billy, Jake, Trevor, TC, Spencer, Chris, Tyler, Jason, Todd, Ralph, John, Don or fifty other people loading up, I'm moving for them.

4) Lessons / total rookies / advanced riders: There is an obvious area at Lincoln where people exchange boards and also launch and land. It's right in front of where all the boards are. NOBODY should be hanging out here with a kite in the air, especially people with limited kite handling skills. Move on, it's a transition zone. If two kites tangle here, it is VERY close to solid objects and public.

5) Lessons / total rookies: If you are not confident enough to go out in to the waves - we totally understand. If you hang in the middle of the butter zone too long, you are just pissing people off. My friend learned how to kite at Lincoln last year, and he spent a TON of time just upwind of the reeds learning how to stay upwind. He was well downwind of most landings and still had pretty good flat water. He dropped his kite a bunch and things were fine. It looks like you might get sucked into that area and never get back to the launch area, but it's shallow and out of the way of high flying traffic. In light wind kiters often drift to that area and are able to easily walk back in waist/chest deep water.

If we all work together on this we can make the space that we have a bit more productive.

My 2 Cents. Let's keep the discussion productive.

[bradsaxe]

And regardless of what your intentions are there are some key Right of Way points to remember....

Starboard Tack has the right of way and generally it is common to yield to the kiter that is launching or landing.
Jumping on the inside while someone is coming off the beach into the water is, well..., not the right way to go about your experience.

Personally I could do without the whole inside jumping thing when it's crowded which I guess is why I get left off the list of cool guys. There is plenty of flat water down wind. I say ban the practice altogether and leave it only for skimboards.....just kidding.

and one more thing, when kiting in close proximity of one another it works quite well if the downwind kiter brings his/her kite close the water and the up wind kiter puts his/her kite high in the window. If you just think a little bit about other people while you are kiting many ROW issues are easily handled and everybody has a good time. Don't be selfish.

Thanks for the post Chris

[jason morton]

Brad- you are definately an underground cool guy. The first purely strapless rider. Been doing it a long time before anyone. And super chill and humble. That's cool!

[brian.doubek]

THere is an ancient proverb from the long lost art of windsurfing:

"Look Twice Before You Jibe"

Adapted to kiteboarding lexicon:

"don't huck ur meat till ya scope the scene...bra"

Before you initiate any transition, look both ways. It's easy to be so focused on what's in front of you that you forget about what's behind. Usually it doesn't matter what's behind but once in a while it does.

[Jake-wright]

fine...you win jason! I'll down the dosage of butter and add some waves to the diet. I've survived so far by not neglecting advice/instruction from the veterans. the smothest wind and water in utah is no reason to start now...although it comes the closest of all things i can think of.

[Todd Jacques]

wow what a good thread. nice job chris, jake, brad, brian, jason, and you others. I really like what brad said "Personally I could do without the whole inside jumping thing when it's crowded" and all of his other wise tips. I alos think I am one sailor that still sails there that hates it when there are two many new or uncool kiters there. I think I am one kiter that takes off as fast as I can and goes out in the middle of the lake by myself when it is like that.

Chris to be clear on your first point. I agree with why you say the sailor coming in should hold tight, but more importantly he has the right of way. The rule is, if I am not mistaken is right hand forward has the right of way. When I am coming in towards beach I assume within reason or doubt I have the right away when another sailor is approching me. The opposite is true when I am coming out I yield to sailor coming in.

Also when the camera comes out it is ridicuols. Notice the same people in all the photos?

Brian funny shit "don't huck ur meat till ya scope the scene...bra"

[Mark Johnson]

So say (you, Todd or someone) are coming in towards the beach headed close to the jetty, but I am hooked up with the wind and able to beat you at your slow progress and cut upwind of you between the jetty to my left and you at my right is it ok to do so as we are not on a collision course.

[Todd Jacques]

Mark i am no expert. I was just giving my two cents. But since you ask I will reply. I think the rules are there to try and follow. Kiting is a unique sailing sport, but still we should try and follow some rules. Pepe made a good point about knowing who you sail with. If I know the people around me I bend rules. If I am unsure about how or who is sailing I get confused.
This is where the problem lies. If we bend rules because of a event, like a race or photo shoot, how do we all read what the other sailor is thinking? One persons special event or circumstance might not be in everyone elses thought process.

To answer your question. If you feel you are not going to cause a issue breaking sailing rules then go for it. I am sure I have gotten to do it as well. I dont always follow sailing rules. But like others who have been chiming in, I am becoming more aware. It is cool that our crew is thinking and talking about it.

[bordy]

So say (you, Todd or someone) are coming in towards the beach headed close to the jetty, but I am hooked up with the wind and able to beat you at your slow progress and cut upwind of you between the jetty to my left and you at my right is it ok to do so as we are not on a collision course.

Mark If you have the ability to clearly out tack the starboard (right hand forward) sailing kiter, while you are on port tack(left hand forward) in side the butter zone you may do so, however if at any point you and the other kiter are covering the same amount of space.....The kite on port take must yeild down wind. and lower their kite while the right of way salor must raise their kite.... you can hot dog ride all you want any where you want if you dont interfer with others. but if you are fighting up wind with other kiters around you must always yeild on port tack.... And if we are follwing thoose rules you shouldnt be the jackass, trying to f up the rotation it naturley creates for jumping, and cruising in and out for board changes....

Just a side note on another rule...unless you are evenly matched ant fighting for the same peice of water the down wind sailor also has the right of way.

Yesterday I had a kiter come right into my bow while ripping down wind on starboard tack...I was on port reach. Todd, and Mark do you think this kiter had the right of way? I was forced to throw my kite in the other dirrection andbecause I did not have ability to go up wind any more since I was over poweredon a reach, and this kiter should have past me at the stearn and changed their point of sail while running to avoid me since I was down wind as they over took me? We were not racing just enjoying the water...

[Mark Johnson]

As I see it a right of way needs to be followed if by remaining on your present course is heading you into a collision. If you are going toward someone and if you both continue you would collide then the person whose right side is facing the wind they stay on path and the other kiter turns downwind. If no collision course then no rule. Please correct me if this is wrong. I see people all the time that as you are aproching each other, and headed into each other, they have the right of way do not take it. They turn down wind and this forces me to either break the rule or turn back the other way. I may have this all wrong but when I kite and the other kiters are doing the right thing it is very easy to kite very close past each other with the down wind kite staying low and the upwind kite staying high. I have also noticed that even with these right of way rules, things sometimes change where the rider with the right of way looses power and the other rider is still powered at the time of passing each other forcing quick renegotiation.

[Mark Johnson]

I typed that last post before reading Billys last post.

[bradsaxe]

Mark I think you bring up some very good points. The wind around here can be very fluky and this creates some gray area situations like when everyone is underpowered and just trying to hold their ground. I am not sure what the answers are in those cases other than to stick to what is known and always err on the side of courtesy.

I think what gets lost sometimes is that, because of the length of our lines, a collision course really should be interpreted as "if you or your kite will likely be anywhere within your fellow kiter's window if everyone involved holds course."

Billy- clearly you had the right of way in that situation but I have, even recently, been locked in going down wind fast and not able to get off it at risk of running in on somebody on the same tack. It happens. Maybe not the case in that situation?

The good news is we have to talk about this cuz it's been so windy everybody is kiting a lot and this is nice. Anyone for another round today?

[Ralph Morrison]

I see people all the time that as you are aproching each other, and headed into each other, they have the right of way do not take it. They turn down wind and this forces me to either break the rule or turn back the other way.

I hate to confuse things further but, if you have the right of way, you have the right to go whichever way you want. (Above OR below an oncoming kiter) That's what "right of way" means. If you are coming at someone and they have the right of way, you have to be prepared to go the way that they aren't. On the other hand, if you do have right of way, you should give a clear indication of which way you're going so there's no confusion.

The problem is that most kiters don't know the rules. I've found that self preservation - turning around and getting out of a tight situation instead of going in just because I have right of way, has worked best for me.

I like what was said about clearing out of the launch area. I'd like to add to that by saying that if there is a kiter that's got their kite in the air and walking to the launch and another kiter coming in to land, the one on land is in more danger and should have the right of way.

[Mark Johnson]

Good point Ralph. I was confusing right of way with the right to stay upwind.

[bordy]

I am going to pull out some old sailing books but I believe it is not the right of way to pick weather you go. Up or down wind, but the starboard tacking sail must past the port tacking sailer up wind, if they are covering the same ground and using the same water. As soon as either kiter goes down wind that kiter then has the right of way , just as the starboard sailor gives right of way back to the port sailor as soon as they are passing up wind of them.

If you are confused about the sailing rules look them up, there are clear rules that cover everything. I don't rememeber there being any gray areas or special circumstance. It is all very cut and dry.

These rules are there so you can show up at any beach and sail with others with out issues. They should be followed at ULLB because it is our busiest spot. And it allows local sailors to have fun while visiting sailors fit right in, and if there ever is a issue we can clearly use the rules to decide who is at fault.