Did LibTech copy the Twisted snowkiteboard?

[mike loeser]

Got an email about this years new snowboard gear. The new Travis Rice pow board looks just like the twisted.
Mike

[jason morton]

The LibTech board was out before the Twisted by a couple years.

[windzup]

the lib takes advantage of the same basic reverse camber concept. However the internal materials and flex are different. The Twisted Velocity has more flex to allow for comfortable kiting across a range of snow and wind conditions. The Libs stiffness was prefered by T-Rice for bomibing steep pow runs... the Velocity performs similar on steeps and deeps, but is more friendly in shallower terrain.

Besides the biggest difference is also the primary selling feature of most boards thes days...the graphics are totally different so they must not be the same...

Windzup,
Brian Schenck

BTW - new Twisted site and graphics coming soon...new Velocity decks are in New Zealand at the Chasta Camp photo shoot as we speak.

[mike loeser]

Yeah, forgot about the Banana Hammock. I am getting deja vu from last year. Think I thought the same thing and had the same conversation. Must be time for it to snow again. The Hammock came out 08/09 as far as I can tell. Still surprised that Libtech doesn't have more of a fish shape like Burton's pow board.
True that the biggest selling point of new gear is the graphics! Walk into Salty Peaks and try and pick out the best gear when they have over 500 models from 50 companies.
Mike

[bordy]

Mike,

Travis and I are old friends I used his idea for a twin tip powderboard while riding for best, lots of people noticed this and tried the same idea, hence the twisted shape, Jake and I spend a year on bananna hammocks before the twisted board even came out. As far as the story goes from my end, I knew about the bananna hammock in 05 and knew right away when I started kiting that it was a better shape.

Of course since I have been shaping snowboards for 20 years I had a bit of a advantage.....

[windzup]

Thats also why we were stoked to have Billy test riding the Twisted boards and giving legitimate feedback....even tho you may never have known it. Rather than become famous and deal with postcards from teeny boppers, Billy wanted to humbly remain behind the scenes away from the lime light.

Oops, Cats out of the bag.

Thanks for putting your time in on the Twisted project Billy.

Most interesting tho, is that the shape has been loved and adopted by the kite community completely, yet its just a gimmick in the downhill world. Well, that is until your ide one and convert to the future!

Windzup,
Brian Schenck

[bordy]

Twisted gang rules!

although I may have had a hand in reconizing a great shape! The crew at Twisted are the folks responsable for bringing the shape to the masses, great board desighns and new school progression is useless unless its avalable for everyone thats what twisted has done for kiters who needed a true SNOWKITE board!!!

I'll be riding twisted prodect again all winter!!!! And trying to talk them in to making snowkite skiis next!!!

I also tink the down hill world just doesn't have enough talented riders that want to do things with either foot foward to help the banana hammock take off, unlike the kite world were we ride either way out of need not want.... Just my take.

Its so fun to have snow topics back on the forum!!!!!

[john l]

hmmmm. snow kite skis? tele version?
never really snowboarded before but enjoyed the twisted last season.

[windzup]

Truth about the origins....the reverse camber Twisted board was not inspired by the T-Rice model....it was originally a powder ski design (the Spatula) that inspired the reverse camber twisted concept, along with trial and error. After trying straight and flat rails, we realized that was not the direction for snowkite boards to go (even tho many a kiter day dreamed about flat rails and cranking across the wind). We found that the more the side cut was extruded in the mid section. the more easily controllable the board became...along with softening it up, as a stiff board is harder to initiate a turn when powered by a kite.

I would wager that T-Rice may have seen some bro-bra skiers rocking reverse camber skis on Pow runs and thought, hey, thats a damn good idea for a board. The fact that this design shape is an amazing snowkite shape is merely coincidental. Obviously there are Zero snowboard companies marketing that shape to kiters, and the end use of each style board is different. Just as kiteboards have different shape and fin placement than a wakeboard, a snowkite board needs different feeling than a snowboard to be perfectly in tune with kite power and the differing direction of constant travel.


More silly thoughts as I think about snow and new shapes to play with this winter

Windzup,
Brian Schenck

[bordy]

Oh yea............... Travis had seen Shane Mconkey ride a pair of water skiis, in a vid down some sick lines, I know this cuz My bro bra skiier friends helped test the proto spatulas here in UT( best snow on earth) and keep telling me about how its all about the camber profile. Then Travis and I were talking powder shapes, on day in the back country (mind you I had not kiteboarded yet) but was working with Dupraz a french Company who was making a commentment to sick pow shapes that I was doing consulting work for so Travis and I were sharing Ideas, I had just finished up a new shape for Prior snowboards called the Kyber, Burton then stole and turned the shape into the Malalo, but to be fair I took a bunch of stuff from the Burton fish and made it more allmountain friendly, and I was sort of bitching about burton stealing shapes and I asked him about the spatulas and he had not seen them but knew about the idea, Via the vid. This was a big deal at the time cuz some girls were winning races on revese camber skiis (until FIS outlawed them) So reverse camber was the hot topic in the shapind scene. When I saw TR later at a reail jam in Breck I asked him if he had finished his pow stick and he told me all abot the hammock being ready for testin! Also when Robby and I talked about the twisted shapes befor I was even a Ozone cat he asked a bunch of ? including about the Banana Hammock, he also spent time riding a hammock. I had offered to get him one at cost from a friend, but he said he could get one from Rossi. SO I would quess the Hammock had a little more to do with the Twisted shape, then maybe brain is letting on to? At the time Jake and I were trying to get Best to make the shape also. At the end of the season there was a bunch of twisted protos to be tested! It was a great process!

Almost all shapes lead into other shapes the idea that one prodect was invented vs evoled is acward.

I heard the Twisted shape was a gift from a angel that floated down and left a perfect imprint in the snow that was then filled with gold and spices to magiclly form the first proto type. Then it was sprinkled with pixe dust and the graphics just apeared!!

Our own Jake Buz went on to win the kiter cross this year on a Lib Hammock, They must work ok for snowkiting? But the twisted works much better, I think!

[jason morton]

The volant spatula was designed by Peter Turner with input from Shane McConkey. Peter now designs for DPS. I have a pair and love them, but not for kiting. The reverse side-cut makes it really hard to edge for long periods of time. Funny how the design kicks ass for snowkiting with boards but not for skiis. Peter also is an engineer at Maclean composites and lives in Eden Ut. Billy- Go change a diaper or something!

[mike loeser]

Glad that my brain fart post provided some good info. Interesting to hear about the "evolution" or "immaculate conception" of the design.
Billy, I knew you designed boards for euro carving, but didn't realize you also did the all mountain stuff. I bought the Malalo last year and have been very happy with it. Learning to ride on a Burton 140 Performer a few years back, it never made sense to me why they didn't make a decent powboard for resort riding. I know they still made swallow tails and such, but there wasn't much in between. I really liked the Burton Fish, but they are trash on any kind of hard pack. After checking the Prior website about the Khyber, I can see the similarities with the Malalo. Billy, you should be pimping your designs more. I would have picked one of those up. Also, any chance to ride with T. Rice? He's my hero. It would be sweet to be hanging in the backcountry watching him ride. Check out his vid That's it, That's all to see what I'm talking about.
I am hoping that the Twisted is the greatest shape since sliced bread, since I picked one up from Brian this summer. I was one of those dumb enough to think that riding a wakeboard kiting on the water would work just fine. I wasted a few weeks trying that out while learning how to kite. A Snowkiteboard makes sense to me.
Not that I have any clue about skiing, but how are Lib's Narrow ass snowboards for kiting? http://www.lib-tech.com/nas/
They have a buy one get one free sale going on right now. Thought that was funny.
Mike L.